[rcannon]

What exactly does the stiffer spring and the star do?
What's involved in fitting those parts,is it an engine strip job?
ZM's vid didn't work this side of the pond.

I wish you could try my bike. Within two shifts you would feel it.

His shift star is a precision made part. The shifts just fall into to place. The spring is more stiff and makes the little roller follow the star.

If I put both in your bike I could tell you that I took your transmission apart. While I had it apart, I polished everything and blueprinted the rest. You owe me 500.00

You would pay the bill and as soon as you rode the bike, you would come back here and tell everyone how amazing I am and how I really know transmissions.

If anyone buys the parts, let us know. It's not impossible to install on a bike that's all put together. This piece is behind the clutch basket.

I have two tips that will save you from dropping pieces down into the oil pan. That sucks when that happens....

 

[zmky]

I have one of those but IMO it's a bit too aggressive on the factory machine matched aluminum case halves. Perhaps on the oil pan it might be OK, but I don't really want to use anything that is abrasive. On a steel engine block for a car, it's perfect for removing gasket material, I just wouldn't use it on aluminum.

I'm going to use the factory Mercedes gasket remover (MB part number 0109899071). This is what I used when I dropped the oil pan on my E-Class and it removes the factory Reinzosil without the need for any abrasive methods. I would think that the factory ThreeBond Kawi uses is nearly identical. Unfortunately I lent my bottle to my neighbor who went a bit liberal on it and used it all up, so hopefully my local MB dealer has a can that i can buy.

when i was a tech for honda, about a year, that’s what our dealership (beaverton-honda, yamaha, suzuki, kawasaki) taught and required us to use on all aluminum engines for removing gaskets. never had any issues. too much risk using a scraper would leave cuts in the metal and risk of not re-sealing. if your worried about it being too abrasive, slow down your speed, don’t push so hard or change to a less abrasive bristle. several options available. we always used the white/120 grit. i never required full speed to remove material though…

 

[zmky]

here is a great video on a 2011 zx10 on how to do the installation. very detailed on the steps, but really just posted it for the general know how. i’m sure our MC will have some of its own unique steps.

 

[Skub]

Very cool vid ZM. I'd imagine the Z1000 lump is pretty similar to the Ten under the clutch basket.

 

[rcannon]

Skub, this is where it gets interesting. The idea is basically the same for all motorcycles. The parts all look similar.

What isnt similar is the access to said parts. Our bikes have these pieces in a nasty spot, for access. If you had the entire engine broken down, no big deal, but most are not going to do that just to replace the spring.

The spring and these shift parts do not have instructions. The idea here is you shouldn't be installing these parts if you dont know how to do the work. It makes sense.

The two secrets are:

1...Stuff something into the bottom of this area that you are working in. If you dont, anything you drop ends up in the oil pan. Cut up sections from a plastic milk jug would be perfect. Thin and strong so nothing gets by.

2...The new spring is stiff to compress with your fingers. To install it, it needs to be compressed and there is no room for your fingers to attempt compressing . What you do is hold the spring up against a wall. Compress it. While its compressed, wrap a piece of safety wire around it. Holding it in the compressed position. Now it's simple to install. Once everything is bolted in place, cut off the safety wire and remove it.

That's it. You are welcome. I just saved you six hours having to remove the oil pan, or trying to figure out how to assemble.

See how the hear blocks access? That's the issue. Concours 14, zx14, simple. Sv650, simple...This one needs a trained monkey.

Even though mine took a long time. Yea, I wasnt expecting a small sleeve to be inside of the stock spring. My sleeve dropped into the oil pan, so I had to remove the exhaust and oil pan to fish it out. So mone took forever. I taught myself some new swear words that day.

It was still worth doing. The spring is way, way overpriced if you consider just the spring, itself. Its not so overpriced when you figure Marc had to install, and test 20-25 springs before he found the perfect wire thickness and diameter for our specific bike. I I theres no way to prove this, and I'm talking out of my ass when I say this, but if these parts avoid transmission damage, it's worth whatever the price is, and I think they do help avoid damage.

The spring is the difficult one. The star would be easy. I didnt need a new clutch cover gasket. That's only because I have 2 spare gaskets in the cuppboard, I'm sure.

 

[Ungarisch]

Got an email from PartZilla. The copper washers for the crank / case bolts (which are mandatory to replace) are on indefinite backorder. This blows my mind as it's not a Z1000 specific part, damn near every Kawasaki ever made uses these washers for the crank bolts. I'm going to call around to local Kawi dealers as this should be a part that they "should" normally stock, and if I can find them locally then I'll just cancel the ones from PartZilla. Looks like all other parts should be shipped out by July 2nd, tho with the holiday it doesn't look like I would get them by the long weekend. The main thing that's holding it up now is the circlip and snap ring for the transmission shaft, which the OEM manual says to replace but the Haynes manual says you can reuse. I might cancel them just so that I have all my parts for the long weekend...

 

[Skub]

Skub, this is where it gets interesting. The idea is basically the same for all motorcycles. The parts all look similar.

What isnt similar is the access to said parts. Our bikes have these pieces in a nasty spot, for access. If you had the entire engine broken down, no big deal, but most are not going to do that just to replace the spring.

The spring and these shift parts do not have instructions. The idea here is you shouldn't be installing these parts if you dont know how to do the work. It makes sense.

The two secrets are:
View attachment 85844
1...Stuff something into the bottom of this area that you are working in. If you dont, anything you drop ends up in the oil pan. Cut up sections from a plastic milk jug would be perfect. Thin and strong so nothing gets by.

2...The new spring is stiff to compress with your fingers. To install it, it needs to be compressed and there is no room for your fingers to attempt compressing . What you do is hold the spring up against a wall. Compress it. While its compressed, wrap a piece of safety wire around it. Holding it in the compressed position. Now it's simple to install. Once everything is bolted in place, cut off the safety wire and remove it.

That's it. You are welcome. I just saved you six hours having to remove the oil pan, or trying to figure out how to assemble.

See how the hear blocks access? That's the issue. Concours 14, zx14, simple. Sv650, simple...This one needs a trained monkey.

Even though mine took a long time. Yea, I wasnt expecting a small sleeve to be inside of the stock spring. My sleeve dropped into the oil pan, so I had to remove the exhaust and oil pan to fish it out. So mone took forever. I taught myself some new swear words that day.

It was still worth doing. The spring is way, way overpriced if you consider just the spring, itself. Its not so overpriced when you figure Marc had to install, and test 20-25 springs before he found the perfect wire thickness and diameter for our specific bike. I I theres no way to prove this, and I'm talking out of my ass when I say this, but if these parts avoid transmission damage, it's worth whatever the price is, and I think they do help avoid damage.

The spring is the difficult one. The star would be easy. I didnt need a new clutch cover gasket. That's only because I have 2 spare gaskets in the cuppboard, I'm sure.

Awesome RC,cheers man. I read from the site in the link it's for 03 - 06 Z1000,I take it there is a kit for the gen 4 bikes,or is it the same?

 

[Ungarisch]

well... I called all 6 Kawasaki dealers in a 50 mile radius and none of them have the washers in stock. Kinda makes you wonder as this washer is required to be replaced every time the case is split, and is the same washer used on every inline Kawi engine made in the last 20 years. So it doesn't look like dealers are doing a lot of engine work on bikes if they don't stock this part. I suppose a case split would mechanically total out pretty much any bike as the labour hours would come close to the value of the bike, but still this part should be stocked!!

I'm not sure if I should try the old trick of reusing copper washers by flipping them or if I should order them from Japan via WeBike. It would cost me about $18 more, but better than waiting on a part "indefinitely". @rcannon what do you think about flipping the crank bolt washers?

 

[Skub]

well... I called all 6 Kawasaki dealers in a 50 mile radius and none of them have the washers in stock. Kinda makes you wonder as this washer is required to be replaced every time the case is split, and is the same washer used on every inline Kawi engine made in the last 20 years. So it doesn't look like dealers are doing a lot of engine work on bikes if they don't stock this part. I suppose a case split would mechanically total out pretty much any bike as the labour hours would come close to the value of the bike, but still this part should be stocked!!

I'm not sure if I should try the old trick of reusing copper washers by flipping them or if I should order them from Japan via WeBike. It would cost me about $18 more, but better than waiting on a part "indefinitely". @rcannon what do you think about flipping the crank bolt washers?

I think it's always going to be in your mind if you cut any corners. Would it not be best to wait and use the other engine in the meantime?

 

[Ungarisch]

I think it's always going to be in your mind if you cut any corners. Would it not be best to wait and use the other engine in the meantime?

Yeah I hear ya. I suppose it's cheaper than buying all new one time use aluminum stretch bolts that all the German manufacturers keep insisting on using... I'll just buy it from WeBike. The reason I wanted them sooner is because we have a long holiday weekend coming up (Independence Day), and I was going to take that time to wrap up the build.

 

[jimz]

I'm not sure if I should try the old trick of reusing copper washers by flipping them

Copper washers and gaskets can be reused if they are heated up thus allowing them to expand. I mean glowing red hot with a propane torch. Get one section red then slowly walk the flame around until every part of it has glowed red. I usually do this on a concrete block, then wipe them down with brake clean or something after they cool. They are now expanded and they will crush and seal as originally designed. It has never failed me and those old two strokes used a lot of copper washers.

 

[rcannon]

Awesome RC,cheers man. I read from the site in the link it's for 03 - 06 Z1000,I take it there is a kit for the gen 4 bikes,or is it the same?

I'm not sure if it is. That's why I was surprised to see that he found the shift star. I didnt see one available for oir specific bike.

 

[Ungarisch]

Yesterday turned out to be a wasted Sunday. I guess you win some, you lose some. Decided to take the engine that's current in the bike apart to inspect the transmission. I removed the shift forks and inspected the gears and found zero issues. Could not nee any rounded dogs on the "top" gear (ther one that drive both 2nd and 4th), however I couldn't really see into the side of the pinion gear (the thing I have been calling the receiving gear) to see if the holes were rounded since it's the very last gear the gap between was not big enough to make out anything. I was really disappointed to see that the shift forks looked perfect, however upon measuring the pad thickness with a caliper, they were on the low side of spec. I grabbed 2 good shift forks from the disassembled engine, which were actually on the upper side of spec, popped those in there hoping it would cure the issues, but upon test ride, exact same issue still remains. Bummer, but at least it gave me a practice run on reassembling the shift forks and shift drum, which was actually easier than I originally thought.

Also I decided to go full bore on the trans rebuild on the original engine. Besides original $550 in parts from Partzilla. I decided to replace 3rd gear pinion as well (slight rounding), along with all gear bushings, washers, spacers, the remaining 2 shift forks, and a bunch of misc items. Basically the only thing that will be original on the output shaft is the shaft itself. This was mainly driven by the fact that i found out that all parts on WeBike is 60% less than Partzilla, which is already 60% less than the dealer. I'm now $800 deep on this but I should have a brand new transmission. The input shaft doesn't have any pinion gears on it so there is not much damage that can occur on it, everything on mine looks mint.

 

[Skub]

This bike is a keeper for sure!

 

[aiarctic]

Hello Ungarisch

Your threads are really informative! I really appreciate it man 🥳

6 of my friends who ride Z1000 had the same issue on the 4th gear (all those 6 riders have installed quick shifters).

The questions are:

1. Did you install quick shifter?
2. On which mileage that you experienced the 4th gear slipped?
3. What was the symptoms? (eg. any first sign or indication before the 4th gear slipped)
4. How often did you do the engine oil intervals? (eg. like 3,000 miles)

I really appreciate for your time and all of my friends are eager to learn from your precious experience.

Cheers, man! 🙂

Below is the shopping list so far. Still needed are Threebond TB1216B (I'm using TB1217H as it's almost identical and 1/4 of the price), and then also gasket remover to remove the factory RTV from the case and grooves.

View attachment 85833
View attachment 85834

 

[rcannon]

You guys know how and why this goes wrong, right?

Quick shifters can be perfectly safe, and ok, but too many people think these turn your manual transmission into an automatic. That is not true.

Ride by wire bikes have more control, so we won't discuss them here.

Our bikes aren't ride by wire. This means even the very best quick shifters are only able to adjust for cuting fuel, or ignition.

This is no problem, but if you were to adjust this quick shifter to the precise time at 8000 rpm,and 4th gear this does not mean the same setting is good at 9000 and 3rd gear.

As you know there is every rpm, say 1000-11,000, and gears 1-6 available. Unless you had specific times set up for all these variables, you won't get a clean shift. Ride by wire can do this.

We really can't with something like a Dynojet quick shifter. When you don't get a clean, perfect shift you cause transmission damage.

Issue 2 is the fact that we dont have a casette transmission. The zx10 does. On a zx10, you slide the transmission out if the side of the engine. Difficult, but not that bad.

Our bike needs to have the bottom of the engine removed. A much more difficult and expensive process.

If you don't mind the risk, no problem, but odds are this isn't going to go very well.

The only quick shifter I would consider is the HM. It has the best technology. Expensive, but way cheaper than a transmission repair. I would also add the factory pro shift spring. You should add the spring, anyway, but it's a must do with the quick shifter.

If you did those two mods, maybe...maybe it would give a reasonable service life.